Style Class, Session #1: Class Intro

[foxfirefey]

Welcome to the DW Styles Class! From the number of people answering the poll, this is going to be a fairly large class, even if a lot of you can't make it. Lurking is, of course, okay! I do want to encourage lurkers to ask questions if they have them, however--you don't have to stay out of sight.

This class is geared around learning by doing. The main project of the class is to create a style of your own! The lessons are tools to help you along the way, so the syllabus is subject to change if I feel we're going over a subject too fast and people need more time to adjust. At the end, I'll have treats for people who share layouts with others at dreamwidthlayouts.

Your mentors are, in no particular order: afuna, ninetydegrees, liv, seleneheart, monarchist, exor674, and, well, me. Mentors are here to help me review lesson plans before they go live and help answer student questions--some are CSS only, others know S2. But! If you know the answer to another student's question, please feel free to help them. We all can work together to learn things.

This class is split up into three "tracks" for different experience levels and goals.

Simplified CSS

Designed for people who want an easier introduction in CSS. It involves making style changes to an existing layout with the base CSS included.

CSS only

Designed for people who want to make a layout from scratch based on existing layout HTML--you can do a lot with just CSS. People might need help with an S2 override or two in order to achieve the effect they really want, but overall the goal is to work with CSS.

S2/CSS

Designed for people who want to be experts in changing both the HTML and CSS of their layout, or building in interesting behaviors. S2 is a programming language and once you know it you'll have few limitations (no JS, some CSS cleaning) in making a style exactly the way you want.

Poll #6596 Original Student Desires and Experience Levels

Open to: Registered Users, detailed results viewable to: All, participants: 151

View Respondents

My class track will be:

View Answers

Simplified CSS
20 (13.4%)

CSS only
17 (11.4%)

S2/CSS
94 (63.1%)

Observation only
18 (12.1%)

I'm interested in this class because:

View Answers

I want to customize my own style
114 (79.2%)

I want to make styles I can share with others
76 (52.8%)

I want to be able to help others with their styles
56 (38.9%)

It's a good way to learn skills I'm interested in, like HTML/CSS or basic programming concepts.
108 (75.0%)

If you have another interest in this class, what is it?

View Answers

CSS Experience

View Answers

None or very little
47 (31.1%)

Beginner
51 (33.8%)

Experienced
44 (29.1%)

Advanced
9 (6.0%)

HTML Experience

View Answers

None or very little
13 (8.6%)

Beginner
51 (33.8%)

Experienced
69 (45.7%)

Advanced
18 (11.9%)

S2 experience:

View Answers

None or very little
107 (70.9%)

Beginner
35 (23.2%)

Experienced
7 (4.6%)

Advanced
2 (1.3%)

Browsers I use or have access to:

View Answers

Chrome
91 (60.3%)

Firefox 3.x
90 (59.6%)

Firefox 4.x
80 (53.0%)

IE6
10 (6.6%)

IE7
12 (7.9%)

IE8
40 (26.5%)

IE9
38 (25.2%)

Opera
54 (35.8%)

Safari
62 (41.1%)

Mobile browsers/devices
66 (43.7%)

Other
13 (8.6%)

My main browser is:

View Answers

Chrome
26 (17.2%)

Firefox 3.x
56 (37.1%)

Firefox 4.x
44 (29.1%)

IE6
0 (0.0%)

IE7
0 (0.0%)

IE8
1 (0.7%)

IE9
1 (0.7%)

Opera
9 (6.0%)

Safari
9 (6.0%)

Mobile browsers/devices
2 (1.3%)

Other
3 (2.0%)

If you answered "Other" for any of the browser questions, what browser(s)?

View Answers

Alright students, as your first exercise I would like you to:

• Say hi, and greet others! Also ask any questions you would like to know before Friday's class on "S2 Background and the Customization Wizard".
• Fill out this poll--it will help me know who has what experience level, and the different reasons people are taking the course for.
• Think about what you want your style to look like, if you'll be making a style for the course!

And now, I'm going through and checking to make sure that all people who answered the original interest poll and don't already subscribe get a reminder to watch this community (unless they have different methods of keeping track)! Hope to hear from you all!

---

Previous: Syllabus

Comments

[sporky_rat]

I'm Sporky! I'm in between experienced and beginner on HTML (my problem is remembering what's legal these days and what's not), my CSS is very limited (yay google?) and I have no idea of what makes S2 tick.

Fey, will having a dreamhack be useful or not?

[foxfirefey]

Fortunately there's not all that much HTML one needs to know to make styles!

You *can* use your dreamhack as a styles testbed, although a paid account is pretty much just as handy and a sight more convenient, but I'll also let people get accounts on my development server to play around with too. A dreamhack is only necessary if somebody is making changes like adding a layout/theme to the codebase, or making changes to core2 or the S2 implemetation, etc, which falls more under the realm of development.

[stealth_noodle]

Hi! I'm pretty good with HTML (though I'm self-taught and started back in the late 90s, so I'm always having moments of "Oops, this is not how we do things anymore") and can more or less fake my through CSS (I had to learn the basics in a hurry over the summer for a project), but I am clueless about S2. So I'm very excited about plugging my knowledge holes. :)

[foxfirefey]

"Wait, you mean we don't patiently craft layouts using byzantine tables anymore, just use a gazillion nesting divs? Whodathunk!"

[stellastars]

Hello, all! I'm really looking forward to this class and hoping it will motivate me to set some time aside to learn something new and update my journal's look.

My knowledge of HTML and CSS are probably best described as "self-taught." I'm really hoping that these lessons will help break me of any bad habits I may have acquired and make me a bit more efficient. (The whole guess-and-check method? So not time efficient!)

I've no knowledge of S2, so I'm very interested in trying to get a grasp on it, too.

And, of course, I'm looking forward to meeting new people around this community!

[foxfirefey]

The other thing this class might do is help you pinpoint faster exactly what got broken by something--one of the lessons is all about using browser developer tools to examine HTML and CSS.

[dreamwriteremmy]

HI!

Another student... or maybe it should be another set of students.

You can call us Dreamers I suppose, but there's probably going to be at least 3 of us asking questions, we just haven't decided who's playing this time around. :)

For some of those poll questions, we wanted more ticky boxes. :P Our default browser changes depending on the computer and OS we're using and what we're testing.

We're somewhere between beginner and experienced... technically by our degree, we SHOULD be experienced, but a learning disability we have bodily seems to interfere with our ability to code from scratch (we process things slowly and sometimes entirely miss where things are supposed to connect. As such we're probably both following along and observing... and likely asking stupid questions from time to time because we may have missed a point somewhere due to that).

- Dreamers

[chratz]

a very wise person once told me that there are no stupid questions, just stupid answers ;)

[cimorene]

Hi, I'm Cim! I've made my own DW S2 style (at my own journal I mean) but my methods always involve a lot of trial-and-error and looking at other styles to copy bits/compare notes and I'd like to have a better understanding/grounding in S2, so the idea of making another one from scratch (and to comply with DW standards!) wouldn't be so daunting. More CSS couldn't hurt, either. I wouldn't call myself an expert or anything, even though I've been using it for a fairly long time.

[foxfirefey]

Yeah, CSS can be so finicky that I hesitate to call myself advanced. I rely too much on things I pick up from others.

[lapillus]

Hi,
I'm one of the lurkers - right now I'm not feeling a great need to redo the style I'm using and certainly don't have any great ideas for something new and different, but I'd like to get a good overview. Who knows, maybe I'll come up with something midway through. Mostly I'm curious about the possibilities.

I have some experience with both HTML and CSS, although more theoretical than practical and all of it self-taught.

[foxfirefey]

I bet the upcoming resources lesson could give you some inspiration!

[stephenie_n_lamaina]

Hi everyone. This account is new but the account I use for fandom fun was created in 2009 and I was on LJ since 2006. I have never worried much about the layout of my LJ or my DW accounts because I am more the type of person is more interested in function.

I learned my first programming language in 1979 (on punch cards) and fell in love with it. After college I did programming for the Navy (not on punch cards). The last time I looked at any serious code was in 1991 when I had my first child. I have no programming experience with anything to do with the internet but have been able to tweek things. I think many times my antique computer knowledge handicaps me when I am trying to learn something new because I assume I will instantly understand it. Also, when I don't need to do something by a deadline, I just keep procrastinating.

By learning with a class, a group, I will have the self-perceived peer-pressure and a weekly deadline to motivate myself to learn.

So to recap: I am old, a procrastinator, and lack motivation. I also believe I can fool myself into overcoming those traits.

Anyway, I am looking forward to learning and hopeful contributing to this class.

Thank you for taking the time to do this,
Stephenie

PS - If you think that you know me through fandom please send me a private message. My boss has access to this profile.

[foxfirefey]

Well, hey, if you need somebody to nag you, let me know. I'm not going to pressure people overall, but I can be annoying and persistant if that's what somebody wants.

[sphinxfictorian]

Hello, all!

I'm Sphinx. Looking forward to learning how to do this thing called CSS! I am most interested in fonts and graphics, as well as using artwork as inspiration. I'm a big Art Nouveau and William Morris girl, so will be wanting to play around with those styles a lot!

[foxfirefey]

If you have any good resources for good background patterns and stuff in the style you like, let me know and I can include it in the resources lesson.

[dorkpie]

Hi guys! I'm Dressa. [:

I do have a question, actually, so here goes:

In regards to browsers, is it just a matter of preference or is there a browser that's recommended/best when it comes to CSS/S2?

[foxfirefey]

Well, the thing about making a style is that it should probably degrade gracefully.

If you want whiz-bang, browsers outside of IE are recommended. Latest Safari/Chrome/Firefox versions are probably best. But you should make sure things don't become unusable in the other browsers even if it is not as pretty.

[baggyeyes]

Hullo, I'm baggyeyes.

I've answered 'experienced' in CSS and HTML, because I'm not a beginner, but in truth, I've lost a lot through lack of usage. So, I'm rusty.

As for the style I am looking at, I was thinking fluid, spare but colorful.

[foxfirefey]

I always think rusty is easier to get back up to speed with than inexperienced, though, so I think that's okay. I have to write to the point where the beginners can understand it, so I think you'll sail through.

[elfin]

Hello! I'm Elf, and I'm quite looking forward to this. I've been meaning to teach myself S2 for ages, but haven't taken the time.

[foxfirefey]

This is a very good excuse!

[snakeling]

Hi!

I used to co-moderate the s2flexisquares comm with afuna, who taught me all I know about S2. Also, I invented the code for the tag clouds that is now used by LJ (and DW if nobody's tinkered with it). *\o/*

I have made all three of my layouts (DW, IJ, and LJ), though not from scratch, and I have decent knowledge of PHP, enough to make my own site.

I haven't used S2 in years, though, and my knowledge of CSS is getting rusty too, so this course will mostly be a way to get myself up to date. I'd love to make a layout from scratch, but I'm crap at design. :P

[foxfirefey]

I was kind of tempted to post to this class to s2styles to see if people over there might be interested but I got too shy.

I gotta say, if you're like me and not that awesome at design or graphics, there's plenty of open source WordPress layouts that can be converted.

[lap_otter]

As a total CSS noob (I can do HTML, and if something is more complex I know a great site for finding specific instructions on a topic, along with a try-it-and-see area... This is their home page) I would kind of like to be able to be super badass and go through all three tracks at once? I doubt that I would be able to keep up but I intend to try anyway. If nothing else, once the class is over I can always come back and individual-study the second and third. *shrug* Either way, it'll be fun~

[foxfirefey]

Heck, you can do whatever you feel up to doing! Doing all three tracks would mean making three layouts, but hey, doing them in synchronicity will probably be pretty convenient. And don't remember that the course material stacks--somebody in S2/CSS is pretty much going to learn the CSS of the other tracks. I don't think it would be hard to "upgrade" your track later, either--you can start out with CSS only or Simplified CSS and then upconvert if you feel like you've gotten comfortable with the material.

[adalger]

Hi. I'm adalger, aka Rob, the quiet member of the triumvirate of evil death cake! yes, that's it, cake! that helms this comm. Way back in the dark ages of 2009, I made this comm because I had been digging through the S2 "documentation" that currently haunts foxfirefey. I figured out how to do a few nifty things, and was helping other people understand what was going on in that dark, murky place, and thought the level of interest I was seeing deserved its own community.

Since then, I have fallen behind the curve rather drastically, to the point that half the time I barely understand the questions here, and can rarely even consider answering. I want to fix this. I'd also like to become active in support again, and this seems a relevant niche.

[foxfirefey]

It's very relevant, especially as we often send people in Support with more advanced styles questions here, because it's easier to answer with comments.

[jesseofthenorth]

Jesse here
Clueless for the most part but trying to learn. No questions perhaps there will be after i get a clue :)

[foxfirefey]

Simplified CSS is a very good way to start!

[chomiji]

Hello, I'm chomiji!

I use HTML just about daily on the job and when I post to DW or LJ, I use lots of inline styles (and am constantly annoyed at the way LJ keeps eliminating which ones I can use), and I have made small changes to the style sheet for the site on which I manage content, but I get nervous every time I consider messing around with the CSS for my LJ and DW accounts.

I'm hoping to get more comfortable with customizing CSS for my accounts and maybe even make a custom layout from scratch.

[illariy]

Right now I am interested in the CSS class, for making a layout from scratch. Later on, I plan to go through the material for S2, too. But since my CSS experience is minimal (changing colours, fonts, border sizes etc, nothing to do with the structure so far), I'm going to focus on CSS first. Maybe I'll need to downgrade to Simplified CSS, depending on available time and brainjuice, we'll see. So excited about this. :D

p.s.:

[illariy]

A belated, but friendly Hi to all! *waves*

[sqweakie]

Hi everyone *waves enthusiasticly*. I'm sqweakie. I've got a little experience with html but really nothing with CCS but I'm eager to learn.

[foxfirefey]

Have you decided what track you're taking yet? Sounds like maybe Simplified CSS would be a good starter.

[sinensis]

heya, I'm sinead. I've got some self-taught HTML and CSS skills (coded my website), but they're pretty rusty at this point. I'm interested in learning about S2, and in the skills I'll need to tweak existing styles or design a new one.

[foxfirefey]

Any ideas for a style you would want to do?

[lilmoka]

Hi, I'm Mok!

I am quite a clueless n00b and I'm really excited about these classes :D :D

[foxfirefey]

I'm so excited too!

[veronicasleeps]

Hey!

I'm Veronica and awfully excited. XD

I'm more or less experienced at tweaking LJ layouts so this will be a challenge... But yeah... Excitement! <3

[foxfirefey]

I'm hoping you will be pleasantly surprised at the provisions DW has made for S2 styles.

[altairtherook]

Salutations, I'm Altair!
I have the most basic knowledge of html, meaning only a few tags, and just about none on CSS. I really appreciate you guys creating this set of courses, and I'm excited to begin!

[foxfirefey]

Do you have any ideas about what you want to do for your style?

[av8rmike]

I heard about this project through the IRC grapevine and figured I would check in here. I'm not very active as a poster or volunteer on DW anymore because I still spend most of my time on LJ. I'm the LJ Support Administrator for Style Systems, I maintain the s2expressive community and have written most of the tutorials there, and occasionally answer questions in the other S2 comms. I mostly look at the programming side (see icon), but I'm not great with design-type stuff. I probably haven't kept up to date enough with the DW-specific stuff to act as a "mentor" but I can answer a lot of the general questions.

This seems like an ambitious project, and I want to thank you for taking it on, Fey!

[foxfirefey]

If you know any people on LJ who might want to take the class, OpenID users are also welcome--even though the course will focus on DW styles, my guess is that LJ users could apply a lot of it to an LJ style instead. I thought about posting to s2styles about it but was really hesitant because it could be seen as evangelizing and I don't want to annoy people.

I don't think you should classify as a mentor just because of the time stuff--BUT I think plenty of the questions will be pretty easy for you, so if you ever want to answer one you see, feel free.

This project DOES feel pretty ambitious because of the sheer amount of people who seem to want to take it, and the scope, but I'm looking forward to it anyway! I figure I can spend a couple hours a week writing lessons and hopefully having fellow mentors will help out with how much time I have to spend fielding questions.

[kitters]

Hello!~ My name is Vanessa, but I answer to Kitters, too. I took a web design class about a year ago where we learned some HTML, but focused more on CSS and used it more, so I'm a lot better with it (I'm kind of in between beginner and advanced with HTML). Funny thing is, I can make a fully-functional informational website from scratch, but can't make an LJ/DW layout. XD But I guess that's because I know nothing about the backend language. So, I mostly just tore apart other people's Flexible Squares and Smooth Sailing-based customized layouts on LJ until I liked the result. I'm really excited about learning S2 so that I can make DW layouts from scratch.

I don't know if the version of IE that comes with Windows 7 is version 7 or 8, so I checked both options. >_>;

Also, I suppose I could volunteer myself to be a mentor in cases of strictly XHTML-based issues since I didn't even know what S2 was. If that's alright, that is.

By the way, it doesn't seem like the "expand" function for threads has been implemented into the new beta yet since it takes me to a completely new page in my fussy Opera. *Slaps it* /off-topic

[foxfirefey]

Yes, there a lot of people who don't know any CSS and some who don't know HTML, and anyone able to tackle those questions frees up mentors who know S2 to focus on those questions.

Ha, I told you it didn't work yet, but don't worry--fu has implemented the expand function in beta mode and she's planning to do a code push some time at the end of the week.

[rahirah]

:late as usual:

Hi! I've done some moderately extensive tweaking to existing styles, but mostly on a piecemeal basis. I'd like to have a more thorough grounding in CSS and any grounding at all in CS2, with the ultimate aim of being able to create styles from scratch.

[foxfirefey]

You are not late! I can totally see all the modifications you made to your style, good work. Any ideas of what kind of styles you want to make?